| 01/24/2011 7:45 am |
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 OFFLINE |  Originally Posted by Shawn Ishness:
Originally Posted by Dødherre Mørktre:
as someone who feels that we can't even fully comprehend the exact nature of god, i don't think he/she/it is an old man with a beard chilling out in the clouds. the bible however, says that we are created in his image. this seemingly leads to a paradox. but what if the manner in which we are fashioned after god, is our free will? basically, our ability to choose. it is our sentience which separates us from all the other beasts of this world.
what do you think?
1) Why would God need gender?
2) Regarding man being created in the image of God, I suspect we've not yet evolved to that 'image'. Granted, something like Conscience isn't a tangible thing like our 5 other sensate functions so it's hard to prove it factually exists, but are Psychopaths (beings without conscience) created in the image of God? If that were so, then wouldn't God have some psychopathic qualities? If God had any psychopathic qualities, then wouldn't that contradict so much of what's believed and taught about God?
what if we've begun to devolve? in nature, evolution only occurs when there are isolated pockets of certain species, who are forced through natural stresses to adapt to their climate. we, on the other hand, now have a global genepool. what we call diversity is fast becoming a genetic hegemony. i think the only evolution our species may see, is in the union of man and machine. we've come to rely so heavily on our technology, that we in turn, are relying on ourselves much less. this doesn't make us smarter, just more dependent. who is truly smarter? the genius who invents technology, or the people who come to rely on it? |
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| 01/24/2011 9:26 am |
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OFFLINE | Originally Posted by Dødherre Mørktre:
Originally Posted by Shawn Ishness:
Originally Posted by Dødherre Mørktre:
as someone who feels that we can't even fully comprehend the exact nature of god, i don't think he/she/it is an old man with a beard chilling out in the clouds. the bible however, says that we are created in his image. this seemingly leads to a paradox. but what if the manner in which we are fashioned after god, is our free will? basically, our ability to choose. it is our sentience which separates us from all the other beasts of this world.
what do you think?
1) Why would God need gender?
2) Regarding man being created in the image of God, I suspect we've not yet evolved to that 'image'. Granted, something like Conscience isn't a tangible thing like our 5 other sensate functions so it's hard to prove it factually exists, but are Psychopaths (beings without conscience) created in the image of God? If that were so, then wouldn't God have some psychopathic qualities? If God had any psychopathic qualities, then wouldn't that contradict so much of what's believed and taught about God?
what if we've begun to devolve? in nature, evolution only occurs when there are isolated pockets of certain species, who are forced through natural stresses to adapt to their climate. we, on the other hand, now have a global genepool. what we call diversity is fast becoming a genetic hegemony. i think the only evolution our species may see, is in the union of man and machine. we've come to rely so heavily on our technology, that we in turn, are relying on ourselves much less. this doesn't make us smarter, just more dependent. who is truly smarter? the genius who invents technology, or the people who come to rely on it?
Haven't people always relied on technology in one form or another? Granted we have so much more tech now than in the past but evolution happens so slowly that we won't know if we have stopped evolving for many 100s of years.
We have lost a lot of skills that our ancestors had due to the advancement of tech but that 's an inevitable side effect of technological advancement. |
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| 01/24/2011 12:01 pm |
Regist.: 01/06/2011
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OFFLINE | Originally Posted by Dødherre Mørktre:
Originally Posted by Shawn Ishness:
Originally Posted by Dødherre Mørktre:
as someone who feels that we can't even fully comprehend the exact nature of god, i don't think he/she/it is an old man with a beard chilling out in the clouds. the bible however, says that we are created in his image. this seemingly leads to a paradox. but what if the manner in which we are fashioned after god, is our free will? basically, our ability to choose. it is our sentience which separates us from all the other beasts of this world.
what do you think?
1) Why would God need gender?
2) Regarding man being created in the image of God, I suspect we've not yet evolved to that 'image'. Granted, something like Conscience isn't a tangible thing like our 5 other sensate functions so it's hard to prove it factually exists, but are Psychopaths (beings without conscience) created in the image of God? If that were so, then wouldn't God have some psychopathic qualities? If God had any psychopathic qualities, then wouldn't that contradict so much of what's believed and taught about God?
what if we've begun to devolve? in nature, evolution only occurs when there are isolated pockets of certain species, who are forced through natural stresses to adapt to their climate. we, on the other hand, now have a global genepool. what we call diversity is fast becoming a genetic hegemony. i think the only evolution our species may see, is in the union of man and machine. we've come to rely so heavily on our technology, that we in turn, are relying on ourselves much less. this doesn't make us smarter, just more dependent. who is truly smarter? the genius who invents technology, or the people who come to rely on it?
In a sense, I do believe we're 'devolving', generally speaking. But I do suppose 'some' are truly evolving. I suspect we don't generally see truly evolving individuals because they exist among us, not in disguise, but just in a sense that they don't stand out.
I dunno the crowd here so I dunno people's various religious views. But to make an example: who's more spiritually evolved; The Cardinal who's dressed up in a flashy wardrobe with a nice-sounding title whom the masses worship with, or the lonely one who seeks their sacred relationship with God privately? Tough call, and there's not really enough information in that tiny question to calculate a true answer. Regardless, I'm not personally impressed with wardrobes and titles.
But then what does it truly mean for humanity to evolve? If it's true that human wars have been largely rooted in religious conflict, then I can't feel that escalating up the ranks of organized religion is the answer. In this question, I often find myself coming back to three gifts that don't seem to exist amongst the rest of the animal kingdom (that I'm aware of anyways); Conscience, Empathy, and Intuition. But the more I learn about these three senses that not every human being exists with, the more I feel they're incomplete. But what else could there be to complement these three powerful things? I don't know, but I suspect that once {or 'if'} it's introduced into humanity, then true human evolution might continue along - maybe closer to that so called 'image' of God. |
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| 01/24/2011 12:08 pm |
Regist.: 01/06/2011
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OFFLINE | Originally Posted by Dennis Young:
Actually I know almost nothing about the faith. Just little tidbits here and there. But as far as I'm concerned, as long as a religion or faith doesn't include strapping on bombs and killing innocent people...then I say live and let live. 
I agree with this so long as people don't start making argumentative God-Comparisons. Like, as in referencing the late George Carlin, MY GOD HAS A BETTER CELL PHONE AND PLAN THAN YOUR GOD! GRRRRRRRRR!
Once we start making God-Comparisons across the various faiths, then I suspect we're showing just how primitive we humans tend to be. |
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| 01/25/2011 4:39 am |
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OFFLINE | Originally Posted by David Macleod:
I don't want to open up another can of worms but Christianity, Judaism and Islam have all got skeletons in their respective closets. Yet as with all religions are religions of peace. It's the corruption of the writings and teachings (amongst other human failings) that leads to the slaughter of innocents the world over.
Yeah. My experience is that its all fun and games until someone says "I'm right and your wrong and death to anyone that doesn't go along with me."
Incidentally I just read a news article entitled:
Iran has arrested about 70 Christians since Christmas in a crackdown that demonstrates the limits of religious tolerance by Islamic leaders who often boast they provide room for other faiths.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110111/ap_on_re_mi_ea/ml_iran_christian_crackdown_3 |
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| 01/25/2011 5:15 am |
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OFFLINE | Originally Posted by Shawn Ishness:
Originally Posted by Dødherre Mørktre:
Originally Posted by Shawn Ishness:
Originally Posted by Dødherre Mørktre:
as someone who feels that we can't even fully comprehend the exact nature of god, i don't think he/she/it is an old man with a beard chilling out in the clouds. the bible however, says that we are created in his image. this seemingly leads to a paradox. but what if the manner in which we are fashioned after god, is our free will? basically, our ability to choose. it is our sentience which separates us from all the other beasts of this world.
what do you think?
1) Why would God need gender?
2) Regarding man being created in the image of God, I suspect we've not yet evolved to that 'image'. Granted, something like Conscience isn't a tangible thing like our 5 other sensate functions so it's hard to prove it factually exists, but are Psychopaths (beings without conscience) created in the image of God? If that were so, then wouldn't God have some psychopathic qualities? If God had any psychopathic qualities, then wouldn't that contradict so much of what's believed and taught about God?
what if we've begun to devolve? in nature, evolution only occurs when there are isolated pockets of certain species, who are forced through natural stresses to adapt to their climate. we, on the other hand, now have a global genepool. what we call diversity is fast becoming a genetic hegemony. i think the only evolution our species may see, is in the union of man and machine. we've come to rely so heavily on our technology, that we in turn, are relying on ourselves much less. this doesn't make us smarter, just more dependent. who is truly smarter? the genius who invents technology, or the people who come to rely on it?
In a sense, I do believe we're 'devolving', generally speaking. But I do suppose 'some' are truly evolving. I suspect we don't generally see truly evolving individuals because they exist among us, not in disguise, but just in a sense that they don't stand out.
I dunno the crowd here so I dunno people's various religious views. But to make an example: who's more spiritually evolved; The Cardinal who's dressed up in a flashy wardrobe with a nice-sounding title whom the masses worship with, or the lonely one who seeks their sacred relationship with God privately? Tough call, and there's not really enough information in that tiny question to calculate a true answer. Regardless, I'm not personally impressed with wardrobes and titles.
But then what does it truly mean for humanity to evolve? If it's true that human wars have been largely rooted in religious conflict, then I can't feel that escalating up the ranks of organized religion is the answer. In this question, I often find myself coming back to three gifts that don't seem to exist amongst the rest of the animal kingdom (that I'm aware of anyways); Conscience, Empathy, and Intuition. But the more I learn about these three senses that not every human being exists with, the more I feel they're incomplete. But what else could there be to complement these three powerful things? I don't know, but I suspect that once {or 'if'} it's introduced into humanity, then true human evolution might continue along - maybe closer to that so called 'image' of God.
sounds to me more like you're talking about personal evolution, rather than the evolution of the human species. |
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| 01/25/2011 8:42 am |
Regist.: 01/06/2011
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Posts: 4294967259
OFFLINE | Originally Posted by Dødherre Mørktre:
Originally Posted by Shawn Ishness:
Originally Posted by Dødherre Mørktre:
Originally Posted by Shawn Ishness:
Originally Posted by Dødherre Mørktre:
as someone who feels that we can't even fully comprehend the exact nature of god, i don't think he/she/it is an old man with a beard chilling out in the clouds. the bible however, says that we are created in his image. this seemingly leads to a paradox. but what if the manner in which we are fashioned after god, is our free will? basically, our ability to choose. it is our sentience which separates us from all the other beasts of this world.
what do you think?
1) Why would God need gender?
2) Regarding man being created in the image of God, I suspect we've not yet evolved to that 'image'. Granted, something like Conscience isn't a tangible thing like our 5 other sensate functions so it's hard to prove it factually exists, but are Psychopaths (beings without conscience) created in the image of God? If that were so, then wouldn't God have some psychopathic qualities? If God had any psychopathic qualities, then wouldn't that contradict so much of what's believed and taught about God?
what if we've begun to devolve? in nature, evolution only occurs when there are isolated pockets of certain species, who are forced through natural stresses to adapt to their climate. we, on the other hand, now have a global genepool. what we call diversity is fast becoming a genetic hegemony. i think the only evolution our species may see, is in the union of man and machine. we've come to rely so heavily on our technology, that we in turn, are relying on ourselves much less. this doesn't make us smarter, just more dependent. who is truly smarter? the genius who invents technology, or the people who come to rely on it?
In a sense, I do believe we're 'devolving', generally speaking. But I do suppose 'some' are truly evolving. I suspect we don't generally see truly evolving individuals because they exist among us, not in disguise, but just in a sense that they don't stand out.
I dunno the crowd here so I dunno people's various religious views. But to make an example: who's more spiritually evolved; The Cardinal who's dressed up in a flashy wardrobe with a nice-sounding title whom the masses worship with, or the lonely one who seeks their sacred relationship with God privately? Tough call, and there's not really enough information in that tiny question to calculate a true answer. Regardless, I'm not personally impressed with wardrobes and titles.
But then what does it truly mean for humanity to evolve? If it's true that human wars have been largely rooted in religious conflict, then I can't feel that escalating up the ranks of organized religion is the answer. In this question, I often find myself coming back to three gifts that don't seem to exist amongst the rest of the animal kingdom (that I'm aware of anyways); Conscience, Empathy, and Intuition. But the more I learn about these three senses that not every human being exists with, the more I feel they're incomplete. But what else could there be to complement these three powerful things? I don't know, but I suspect that once {or 'if'} it's introduced into humanity, then true human evolution might continue along - maybe closer to that so called 'image' of God.
sounds to me more like you're talking about personal evolution, rather than the evolution of the human species.
No. Most people exist with the capacities for Conscience, Empathy, and Intuition. But most people aren't taught the value in nurturing these three senses. One of my fears is that the more we humans, by and large, fail to nurture these three things, the greater the chances are that they'll stop manifesting on down the generations, and more and more psychopaths will emerge. And the more psychopaths that emerge among us, to me, is an indication of humanity devolving. But if society were to place more value on personal & spiritual growth, then I suspect human evolution could get back on course.
It seems to me that personal & spiritual growth is widely stigmatized. I feel that the fast growing popularity of Reality TV helps demonstrate this. When I see the cast of Jersey Shore on the various talk shows or hear ladies at work talking about some show called "Bad Girls" or something like that, I find myself disgusted with their overall behavior. But if personalities like these are setting the social standards for rising generations, then I suspect this stigmatization I mentioned could eventually squash it in its entirety.
Briefly, it's not popular to grow up, but if unconscionable and grossly immature behavior become the favored standard, then it seems to make sense we'll devolve and/or self-destruct. |
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| 01/25/2011 12:00 pm |
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OFFLINE | Originally Posted by David Macleod:
Haven't people always relied on technology in one form or another?
We have lost a lot of skills that our ancestors had due to the advancement of tech but that 's an inevitable side effect of technological advancement.
well, you're kind of arguing my point. yes. humanity has always relied on technology, but as we progressively incorporate more and more layers of tech into our lives, we gradually rely on our own physiology less. so what i'm trying to get at, is that our technological evolution has taken the place of natural evolution. we don't have to be stronger, faster, and smarter anymore, because our machines allow us to remain unchanged physically. and if the trend continues, our technology will progress, while our physical bodies will digress. |
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| 01/27/2011 9:36 am |
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OFFLINE | Originally Posted by Dennis Young:
Originally Posted by David Macleod:
I don't want to open up another can of worms but Christianity, Judaism and Islam have all got skeletons in their respective closets. Yet as with all religions are religions of peace. It's the corruption of the writings and teachings (amongst other human failings) that leads to the slaughter of innocents the world over.
Yeah. My experience is that its all fun and games until someone says "I'm right and your wrong and death to anyone that doesn't go along with me."
Incidentally I just read a news article entitled:
Iran has arrested about 70 Christians since Christmas in a crackdown that demonstrates the limits of religious tolerance by Islamic leaders who often boast they provide room for other faiths.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110111/ap_on_re_mi_ea/ml_iran_christian_crackdown_3
Iran has been persecuting (read arresting and hanging) Bahai's for decades. Maybe the rounding up of Christians will highlight the plight of others there and increase the pressure on Iran to change their behaviour. Then again I won't be holding my breath.... |
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| 01/27/2011 9:53 am |
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OFFLINE | Originally Posted by Dødherre Mørktre:
Originally Posted by David Macleod:
Haven't people always relied on technology in one form or another?
We have lost a lot of skills that our ancestors had due to the advancement of tech but that 's an inevitable side effect of technological advancement.
well, you're kind of arguing my point. yes. humanity has always relied on technology, but as we progressively incorporate more and more layers of tech into our lives, we gradually rely on our own physiology less. so what i'm trying to get at, is that our technological evolution has taken the place of natural evolution. we don't have to be stronger, faster, and smarter anymore, because our machines allow us to remain unchanged physically. and if the trend continues, our technology will progress, while our physical bodies will digress.
We haven't got to be faster, stronger, smarter thanks to tech but we still need to be active in order to stay healthy and keep our minds and bodies healthy. So I don't think we will de-evolve as such. |
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| 01/27/2011 12:37 pm |
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OFFLINE | Originally Posted by David Macleod:
Originally Posted by Dødherre Mørktre:
Originally Posted by David Macleod:
Haven't people always relied on technology in one form or another?
We have lost a lot of skills that our ancestors had due to the advancement of tech but that 's an inevitable side effect of technological advancement.
well, you're kind of arguing my point. yes. humanity has always relied on technology, but as we progressively incorporate more and more layers of tech into our lives, we gradually rely on our own physiology less. so what i'm trying to get at, is that our technological evolution has taken the place of natural evolution. we don't have to be stronger, faster, and smarter anymore, because our machines allow us to remain unchanged physically. and if the trend continues, our technology will progress, while our physical bodies will digress.
well, aren't we being told that obesity is out of control? it's kind of a race between our physical deterioration, and our medical advancements. i see a day when the boundary between our bodies and our technology is broken, and we become more bio-mechanical. either that, or yes, we digress and waste away, sitting in our lazy-boys while plugged in.
We haven't got to be faster, stronger, smarter thanks to tech but we still need to be active in order to stay healthy and keep our minds and bodies healthy. So I don't think we will de-evolve as such.
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| 01/28/2011 11:29 am |
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OFFLINE | Originally Posted by David Macleod:
Iran has been persecuting (read arresting and hanging) Bahai's for decades. Maybe the rounding up of Christians will highlight the plight of others there and increase the pressure on Iran to change their behaviour. Then again I won't be holding my breath....
Me either.
really the world already knows what sort of brutal regime Iran has. They just dont care. Maybe they are waiting for the US to invade? |
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| 01/29/2011 10:17 am |
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OFFLINE | Originally Posted by Dennis Young:
Originally Posted by David Macleod:
Iran has been persecuting (read arresting and hanging) Bahai's for decades. Maybe the rounding up of Christians will highlight the plight of others there and increase the pressure on Iran to change their behaviour. Then again I won't be holding my breath....
Me either.
really the world already knows what sort of brutal regime Iran has. They just dont care. Maybe they are waiting for the US to invade?
I don't think the rest of the world doesn't care as much as it's inconvenient to admit that they know what's going on. People tend to be too wrapped up in their own lives to notice or ask what is going on with anyone else and it's exaggerated at National level.
The world needs to change but that change can't be forced on people. It's up to internal forces within each Country to make that change happen. |
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| 01/31/2011 5:19 am |
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OFFLINE | i don't think the world will ever change. at his core, man is the same now, as man has always been. imo, we are what we are. we are tribal by nature, and while we have a capacity to love, we have a propensity to hate. we have formed a complex social system around us, instilling values and whatnot, but at best, all these do is suppress our natural desires, while never overcoming them. in a way, all they've taught us to do is to hide from them, rather than acknowledge them. |
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