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Hugo Roele - pain, when seeing pain in others

10/16/2012 1:00 pm

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Hugo RoeleSome people find it hard to hear and see pain. Others find it hard to hear and see anger. Why is it sometimes so hard to see these emotions? According to what I've learned these emotions are just signs that needs are not fulfilled. And I feel so relieved when I can express my emotions, all of them. Why is it often so hard for people to accept them just as they are?

Richard Schut

because we have learnt that some emotions are 'bad', even seeing these emotions in others triggers this 'bad' feeling
interesting way to find out which emotions are blocked as 'bad' in a person:
if you can 'play' an emotion fully, you are free from it, if you can't play/act them you most likely feel uncomfortable if you see them in others as well
anything that nurtures the need that made you post your post?
Madeleine Aguirre
i find it hard to hear & see pain because i find it so difficult to be with and accept my own pain. i don't want to suffer! and so i imagine the same for others... i want to take away their pain the same as i want mine to stop.
i have learnt to practice being present with the pain of others, hearing seeing and loving it without needing to fight it or change it, but it was a hard skill to learn, and i fail to practice it when i myself am upset and unresourceful. Even when i am feeling quite resourceful, i still find it much harder to be present and accepting with my own pain. It just hurts!

Rémi Romeder
Others can't hear our pain when they believe they're at fault. (Not sure but may be Marshall said that)
Madeleine Aguirre

Rémi
, can you say more about that,^ please? I am so curious, and i think it could be so helpful for me...
Rémi Romeder

Hi Madeleine, very tired now. I am not sure what else I can say now that would make sense. Would you be willing in order to help me knowing what more to say what led you to think it would be helpful to hear more from me, if it is still alive for you...
Susanne Christensen

A bit like what Rémi said: For me, it gets hard when I hear blame. Directed at me - or even someone else in the room - guess I identify with them. But you can get mad at the government around me, no problem;-)

26 July at 01:50
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Madeleine Aguirre

Thanks for your response Remi, let's save it for another day i went searching online for more info on your sentence above, and as a result of my findings i have just bought & downloaded "getting past the pain between us" as an ebook - it has answers to my questions
I hope you enjoy a lovely peaceful sleep dear Remi

26 July at 01:52
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Rémi Romeder

Reading Suzanne stimulated desir in me to try to be a bit more clear around my understanding of the sentence. No matter how much blame there is around me directed toward me or not... I stop being able to hear any pain if I believe I am at fault... even my pain I can't hear. I literally can't hear my own pain if I believe there is something wrong with me.Too busy trying to fix the unfixable or busy trying to hide to avoid potential pusishment or rejection. And it does not depend on wether there is blame or not around or inside me, what stops me from hearing is if I believe I am at fault. Same thing with others, I think they can't hear my pain if they believe there is something wrong with themselves... too busy trying to fix or to hide... I also found one great exemple in the book "Being Me, Loving You" by Marshall. Getting past the pain between us... I love this book. I cried so much reading it...Deep

26 July at 02:05
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Rémi Romeder

I am so exhausted I am afraid I might not have been very clear. Please let me know if it helps. lots of love

26 July at 02:06
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Guto Ffowc

I hope I can remember the gist of what Marshall Rosenberg said:
it is when we HEAR* criticism, or that we are the cause of the other person's feelings. Fault, blame,shame, guilt, defencivenss.
*CAPS in the abscence of italics.

26 July at 09:17
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Rémi Romeder

Guto i'd like to check we have the same understanding. I hear the word "hear" in at least two ways. For exemple I heard Annie saying to me "My whole being say no". And I can believe I am at fault for her aying this after I asked her to talk with me... and if so I can't hear what she might feel and need. she did not say you are at fault and it is true than on the moment I heard blame, in other word I hear inside that there was something with the moment, with her, with her choice of words... and therefore it was almost impossible to connect with the beauty of the moment... the pain, was not sweet in other words... I could not hear the pain... I was literally resisting, tense, stressed.... in pain... but I couldn't grasp it... I was up in my head thinking something is wrong here I should be able to respond with more ease here... I hope this help.

26 July at 13:35
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Guto Ffowc

Rémi Romeder
, I can relate to that. its getting past the other person's anger and letting them own it, rather than thinking we are resonsible for it. Not an easy task, for me.

26 July at 14:28
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Rémi Romeder

I am talking about owning our listening... and hearing that sometimes other can't hear cause they are busy thinking they are at fault... I talking about being responsible for the making sure I hear their need and making sure they hear mine... and I am talking about how hard work it is sometimes... impossible without help especially when I believe I am at fault...

26 July at 14:47
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Rémi Romeder

so my understanding is that it is about supporting the listening... and connecting with the humanity of everybody' involved. Anyway... I assume my ability to hear is diminishing as I am judging myself thinking I spend to much time on Facebook today... I should be outside enjoying the nice wether... considering I have a workshop at 7pm.... I am confused... still I hope my words help. Please let me know if it does.

26 July at 14:51
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Kim O'Bryen

I'm really interested in this topic. I appreciate you bringing it up Hugo.
After watching the video of Christian Keysers about his book "Empathic Brain", I'm swimming around all the great information he talked about just in the videos about his book. So I'm thinking more along the lines that the mirror neurons that fire in us automatically start us feeling the feelings because we are seeing and hearing another person's anger or pain. Since anger and pain are usually difficult for most or considered bad in American culture, I can understand how I for example start feeling the feelings I am seeing and hearing as I speak to this person who is angry or in pain. We want to fix it and make it go away since there is an uncomfortable sensation.
This is what I've experience for years now with my partner who I will be separating from in the next few weeks, plans are being made.
I spoke more about this with my NVC group on Tuesday night which I gained some insight of how I really long for shared understanding and shared responsibility, but also how I see he is in so much pain that he shares freely. He's unhappy with almost everything, which for me has feel so draining and painful seeing how unhappy he is.
I appreciate that someone can express their anger and pain, which is information that can be used to make changes or to reflect on that needs are up for you. I have difficulty when the expression happens repeatedly and nothing changes.

26 July at 17:46
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Madeleine Aguirre

Rémi
, what you said at 2:05 on 26th July was really helpful for me, thank you it meets my need for learning and understanding

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